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	<title>Comments for Yagnavalky&#039;s Blog</title>
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	<link>http://yagnavalky.com</link>
	<description>Storage, Server and Virtualization</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 18 Mar 2011 05:24:57 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Dealing with enormous data by admin</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/storage/dealing-with-enormous-data/comment-page-1/#comment-179</link>
		<dc:creator>admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Mar 2011 05:24:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=203#comment-179</guid>
		<description>Hi Dustin,

You are correct. I made the mistake of saying it was Bycast when I actually meant Spinnaker. Thanks for pointing it out. I will have this corrected in the blog.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Dustin,</p>
<p>You are correct. I made the mistake of saying it was Bycast when I actually meant Spinnaker. Thanks for pointing it out. I will have this corrected in the blog.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Dealing with enormous data by Dustin M</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/storage/dealing-with-enormous-data/comment-page-1/#comment-178</link>
		<dc:creator>Dustin M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Mar 2011 22:48:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=203#comment-178</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m pretty sure NetApp&#039;s cluster technology (now available in 8.0 and formerly available in GX) comes from their Spinnaker acquisition (2004, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetApp#Major_acquisitions). Bycast made object storage technology, which NetApp now sells as StorageGRID.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m pretty sure NetApp&#8217;s cluster technology (now available in 8.0 and formerly available in GX) comes from their Spinnaker acquisition (2004, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetApp#Major_acquisitions)" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetApp#Major_acquisitions)</a>. Bycast made object storage technology, which NetApp now sells as StorageGRID.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Dealing with enormous data by admin</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/storage/dealing-with-enormous-data/comment-page-1/#comment-176</link>
		<dc:creator>admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Mar 2011 15:59:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=203#comment-176</guid>
		<description>Madhu,

That is a nice perspective.  

I didn&#039;t mention other smart things being done like Parallel NFS. Maybe that is a subject for another post. But yes, we need to do smart things to both store data and also to retrieve business relevant information from the stored data. Smartness will never go out of fashion for sure!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Madhu,</p>
<p>That is a nice perspective.  </p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t mention other smart things being done like Parallel NFS. Maybe that is a subject for another post. But yes, we need to do smart things to both store data and also to retrieve business relevant information from the stored data. Smartness will never go out of fashion for sure!!!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Dealing with enormous data by Madhu Parthasarathy</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/storage/dealing-with-enormous-data/comment-page-1/#comment-175</link>
		<dc:creator>Madhu Parthasarathy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Mar 2011 14:09:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=203#comment-175</guid>
		<description>Hi Suresh,
Good post. Data intensive science has three basic functions.
1. Capture 2. Curate 3. Analysis
Most of the focus of the companies is on the first part and the manner you store affects the stage-3. But, curate phase is essentially application driven.
Now, bland data storage would not be adequate given the facts input technologies (like sensors, robots and so on) are improving faster than the storage - The evidential deluge. Hence, some kind of &quot;algo&quot; is required to store data smartly and yet service a broader array of applications. If you know most of the data is going to be particular type (say a standard header and a payload) some of the hardcore header processing for example can be moved to as low level as possible and so on. 

Just like bandwidth, storage is going to be another fundamental dimension.
(1) MIPS (2) Memory/storage (3) Bandwidth 
Each application would have to make judicious design decisions based on the above 3.
Hence storage play would be very critical.

Database demigod Jim Gray has offered many approaches to this nagging problem (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Gray_(computer_scientist)).

Net net, we are moving from an era of math models to data driven models which runs to many peta byes - in which case, you don&#039;t need models - correlation would be enough. So, smart and flexible storage would be welcome in the near future.

cheers,madhu</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Suresh,<br />
Good post. Data intensive science has three basic functions.<br />
1. Capture 2. Curate 3. Analysis<br />
Most of the focus of the companies is on the first part and the manner you store affects the stage-3. But, curate phase is essentially application driven.<br />
Now, bland data storage would not be adequate given the facts input technologies (like sensors, robots and so on) are improving faster than the storage &#8211; The evidential deluge. Hence, some kind of &#8220;algo&#8221; is required to store data smartly and yet service a broader array of applications. If you know most of the data is going to be particular type (say a standard header and a payload) some of the hardcore header processing for example can be moved to as low level as possible and so on. </p>
<p>Just like bandwidth, storage is going to be another fundamental dimension.<br />
(1) MIPS (2) Memory/storage (3) Bandwidth<br />
Each application would have to make judicious design decisions based on the above 3.<br />
Hence storage play would be very critical.</p>
<p>Database demigod Jim Gray has offered many approaches to this nagging problem (<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Gray_(computer_scientist)" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Gray_(computer_scientist)</a>).</p>
<p>Net net, we are moving from an era of math models to data driven models which runs to many peta byes &#8211; in which case, you don&#8217;t need models &#8211; correlation would be enough. So, smart and flexible storage would be welcome in the near future.</p>
<p>cheers,madhu</p>
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		<title>Comment on Dealing with enormous data by admin</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/storage/dealing-with-enormous-data/comment-page-1/#comment-174</link>
		<dc:creator>admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Mar 2011 11:24:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=203#comment-174</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the comment.

What you say is very correct. There are only a certain number of ways you can speed things up and in an abstract sense most domains use similar concepts.  And you correctly said it, there will never be &#039;one shoe fits all&#039; kind of solution. Most of the companies would love to get &#039;one shoe fits lot of people&#039; kind of solution. Therefore at any point in time there are going to be niche players who would be providing optimal solution for a particular problem. That way if you understand some of the important problems and have the capability of providing a solution, you have a good chance of winning in the market.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the comment.</p>
<p>What you say is very correct. There are only a certain number of ways you can speed things up and in an abstract sense most domains use similar concepts.  And you correctly said it, there will never be &#8216;one shoe fits all&#8217; kind of solution. Most of the companies would love to get &#8216;one shoe fits lot of people&#8217; kind of solution. Therefore at any point in time there are going to be niche players who would be providing optimal solution for a particular problem. That way if you understand some of the important problems and have the capability of providing a solution, you have a good chance of winning in the market.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Dealing with enormous data by Ramesh N R</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/storage/dealing-with-enormous-data/comment-page-1/#comment-173</link>
		<dc:creator>Ramesh N R</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Mar 2011 11:06:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=203#comment-173</guid>
		<description>Suresh, 
     Thanks for the nice post and it was informative. While reading it, I could see some analogies with way computing handles different types of problems. We have specific parallel architectures like SIMD, MIMD etc. based on the type of problem in hand as that seems to be the only way to get the performance needed to solve problems in reasonable time. We also have specific HW architectures for handling the Graphics pipeline, and increasingly we see accelerators for Video being designed into chips. In some ways I thought it mirrors what the storage world is doing to handle different data storage/access combinations. Of course the OLTP versus DWH software also involves some significant differences in the software architecture to get the speed needed, coupled with the storage systems. I recently heard about some companies creating specific file systems to handle video storage and it mirrors what you have mentioned about the NetApp acquisition.

      So, one fundamental principle seems to be to not try a one size fits all approach and customize to a reasonable sub-class of problems..

Best Regards,
N.R. Ramesh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Suresh,<br />
     Thanks for the nice post and it was informative. While reading it, I could see some analogies with way computing handles different types of problems. We have specific parallel architectures like SIMD, MIMD etc. based on the type of problem in hand as that seems to be the only way to get the performance needed to solve problems in reasonable time. We also have specific HW architectures for handling the Graphics pipeline, and increasingly we see accelerators for Video being designed into chips. In some ways I thought it mirrors what the storage world is doing to handle different data storage/access combinations. Of course the OLTP versus DWH software also involves some significant differences in the software architecture to get the speed needed, coupled with the storage systems. I recently heard about some companies creating specific file systems to handle video storage and it mirrors what you have mentioned about the NetApp acquisition.</p>
<p>      So, one fundamental principle seems to be to not try a one size fits all approach and customize to a reasonable sub-class of problems..</p>
<p>Best Regards,<br />
N.R. Ramesh.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Talk to me intelligently by Madhu Parthasarathy</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/linux/talk-to-me-intelligently/comment-page-1/#comment-170</link>
		<dc:creator>Madhu Parthasarathy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2011 12:21:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=195#comment-170</guid>
		<description>Hi Suresh
Comprehensive review. Thanks.
It looks to me you have taken a chance and ended up with good book.
If it was any specific process to glean such a first rate book, share with your readers!.
Cheers,
madhu</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Suresh<br />
Comprehensive review. Thanks.<br />
It looks to me you have taken a chance and ended up with good book.<br />
If it was any specific process to glean such a first rate book, share with your readers!.<br />
Cheers,<br />
madhu</p>
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		<title>Comment on Talk to me intelligently by admin</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/linux/talk-to-me-intelligently/comment-page-1/#comment-169</link>
		<dc:creator>admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2011 06:42:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=195#comment-169</guid>
		<description>Ravi,

It does look like we are from a different planet when we talk about good programmers, isn&#039;t it :)

What you express is something which lot of senior folks in India and other places express routinely. My friends like Ramesh, who had commented here, are trying their best to work with various universities and rectify this issue.  As you very rightly point out, the prestige of being a &#039;manager&#039; outweighs the joy of writing good programs for many people. The situation is definitely different in Canada / US / Europe, where the &#039;manager&#039; tag doesn&#039;t carry too much weight. Infact a contact of mine, who was once my client, has been doing just bug fixing for the last 25 yrs. There is no way such deep knowledge can be replaced with people with couple of years experience but it routinely happens.

I don&#039;t think you are being skeptical. If we need to correct a situation, we need to first accept that such a situation exists.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ravi,</p>
<p>It does look like we are from a different planet when we talk about good programmers, isn&#8217;t it <img src='http://yagnavalky.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>What you express is something which lot of senior folks in India and other places express routinely. My friends like Ramesh, who had commented here, are trying their best to work with various universities and rectify this issue.  As you very rightly point out, the prestige of being a &#8216;manager&#8217; outweighs the joy of writing good programs for many people. The situation is definitely different in Canada / US / Europe, where the &#8216;manager&#8217; tag doesn&#8217;t carry too much weight. Infact a contact of mine, who was once my client, has been doing just bug fixing for the last 25 yrs. There is no way such deep knowledge can be replaced with people with couple of years experience but it routinely happens.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think you are being skeptical. If we need to correct a situation, we need to first accept that such a situation exists.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Talk to me intelligently by Ravi Natarajan</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/linux/talk-to-me-intelligently/comment-page-1/#comment-168</link>
		<dc:creator>Ravi Natarajan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2011 03:25:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=195#comment-168</guid>
		<description>Not sure which world you live in Suresh:-)

My understanding of the great Indian programmer is that, by the time they really get a hang of their first computing language, they have already become a manager!

He is now into a different sort of pipelining :-)  If he is not a programmer doing something useful (the only true computing profession is a programmer - everything else is frills) he calls himself an architect. I spoke to one of my programmers who used to work for me some 15 years ago recently.  He told me that he spends most of his time drawing pictures in Visio - that&#039;s life of an architect!

The programming position is still alive in the West. Being a manager does not have the social status here as it is in India. Unfortunately, such committed souls are getting replaced quickly by Indian programmers who have spent less than 2 years as full-time programmers.  Most Indian programmers, working in India I have worked with, do not have a deep understanding of data structures and programming discipline though they all claim to have a CS degree.

Maybe I am too skeptical. The only true product that has come out recently from India is the zoho products written by high school passed guys. I think that is the best model. Get talent out of high school and resurrect the pride of being a programmer. Forget the engg kids from any institution. 

My 2 cents.

Ravi Natarajan</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not sure which world you live in Suresh:-)</p>
<p>My understanding of the great Indian programmer is that, by the time they really get a hang of their first computing language, they have already become a manager!</p>
<p>He is now into a different sort of pipelining <img src='http://yagnavalky.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' />   If he is not a programmer doing something useful (the only true computing profession is a programmer &#8211; everything else is frills) he calls himself an architect. I spoke to one of my programmers who used to work for me some 15 years ago recently.  He told me that he spends most of his time drawing pictures in Visio &#8211; that&#8217;s life of an architect!</p>
<p>The programming position is still alive in the West. Being a manager does not have the social status here as it is in India. Unfortunately, such committed souls are getting replaced quickly by Indian programmers who have spent less than 2 years as full-time programmers.  Most Indian programmers, working in India I have worked with, do not have a deep understanding of data structures and programming discipline though they all claim to have a CS degree.</p>
<p>Maybe I am too skeptical. The only true product that has come out recently from India is the zoho products written by high school passed guys. I think that is the best model. Get talent out of high school and resurrect the pride of being a programmer. Forget the engg kids from any institution. </p>
<p>My 2 cents.</p>
<p>Ravi Natarajan</p>
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		<title>Comment on Talk to me intelligently by admin</title>
		<link>http://yagnavalky.com/linux/talk-to-me-intelligently/comment-page-1/#comment-167</link>
		<dc:creator>admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jan 2011 05:00:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://yagnavalky.com/?p=195#comment-167</guid>
		<description>Ramesh,

I definitely expected you to comment :) since you have straddled both the worlds. As you rightly say, it is imperative for many programmers to understand what happens at a low level. 

Do borrow the book from me, read it and let me know you views. As you said, if you find it good we should go ahead and suggest to colleges to use this as a reference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ramesh,</p>
<p>I definitely expected you to comment <img src='http://yagnavalky.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  since you have straddled both the worlds. As you rightly say, it is imperative for many programmers to understand what happens at a low level. </p>
<p>Do borrow the book from me, read it and let me know you views. As you said, if you find it good we should go ahead and suggest to colleges to use this as a reference.</p>
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